PARK & RECREATION BOARD
MINUTES – SEPTEMBER 11, 2007
The regular meting of the Park & Recreation Board of the
Park & Recreation Board: David Fritchey, Chairman
Henry Carpenter, Vice Chairman
Patricia Bunn, Secretary (joined meeting in progress)
Fran McDonald, Member
Andrew Newbon, Member
Dennis Wysocki, Member (joined meeting in progress)
Others: Donna Liney, Recreation Director
Greg Stoloski, Pool Manager
Ted Wallover, Pool Consultant (left meeting in progress)
Steve Santarsiero, Supervisor Liaison
Absent: David Gordon, Park & Rec Member
APPROVAL OF MINUTES
Mr. Carpenter moved, Mr. McDonald seconded and it was unanimously carried to approve the Minutes of May 8, 2007.
DISCUSSION AND MOTION ON POOL IMPROVEMENTS
Mr. Ted Wallover stated he recommended looking at a revision of the Master Plan which
was prepared in 2002 taking the tot pool up to today’s standards. He stated they also
wanted to try to improve eating space in the concession area. He stated he feels
they are looking to provide more room for outdoor dining. He stated they may also consider changes to
the circulation where you enter the complex.
He stated in the original Master Plan they had considered a water
playground at the tot area where there would be a splash pad with no standing
water. It would be a soft surface with a
series of interactive play toys. They
would then have a standard tot pool 8” to 15” deep with more interactive play
toys and “beach” access which would meet
September 11, 2007 Park & Recreation Board – page 2 of 8
Mr. Wallover stated he feels it is important to maintain the pavilion as it does get a lot of
use. He stated they have considered restructuring the entrance area, and provide a new
ramp to the upper area or have a stair area and create a
lesser slope to comply with
Mr. Wallover stated a new filter building also needs to be constructed in the area in the
front of the Pool Complex which will house chlorination and sanitizing equipment related
to the tot pool. He stated there are some new technologies they are comfortable with that
were not available when they did the original study. He stated for the tot pool area they
may want to consider including ultraviolet as a supplement to chlorination as it is useful
in case of accidents as it kills the pathogens. This is an add-on system not a substitute
for chlorination. He stated it should be done for all the pools at some point in time.
He stated it is an expensive system. Mr. Fritchey asked if it would be cost-effective to
do all the pools at the same time, and Mr. Wallover stated they have not had any real
problem with the larger pools; and they would probably only get a minor price break
doing them all at once. He feels the tot pool and intermediate pool are the pools were
there is more potential for accidents. Mr. Wallover stated it would cost $8,000 to
$12,000 for the tot pool and $12,000 to $14,000 for the intermediate pool.
Mr. Wysocki joined the meeting at this time.
Mr. Wallover stated the project is a two-part project – the tot pool restoration and
associated site improvements and the second is the
installation of the
access ramp to the 50 meter pool.
Mr. Stoloski asked how high the outside filter room would be and asked if it could be a
lowered somewhat or be a vault. Mr. Wallover stated while they have done this, they are
difficult to work with. He noted a location on the map where it would not create any
sight line issues. Mr. Stoloski asked how they would tie it in with the heating system as
the heating system for the tot pool is located out of the back of the office building.
Mr. Wallover stated he feels all the tot pool equipment should be in one location.
He stated if they decide to look at the intermediate pool, it may make sense to do one
small structure to handle both pools and take the associated equipment out of the
existing building which would provide more workable space in the existing building.
Mr. Stoloski asked if they should consider other options such as solar or electric so that
they do not get involved in moving gas lines. Mr. Wallover stated in terms of cost for
pool heating, gas is still the best. He stated it is possible because the body of water
involved for the tot pool is so small, they may want to look at higher efficiency electric
systems as they only need to take the chill off during part of the season because it is so
small it tends to heat up quicker than other pools and is affected by the sun so much
quicker. He stated extending the gas line from the current location may be cost
prohibitive. Mr. Wallover noted the existing system is approaching its life expectancy,
and he feels it would be best to provide a new substation for the tot pool and get all the
equipment for it out of the existing location. He stated the Township Pool is very well
\maintained compared to most Municipal pools, but the systems are still aging.
September 11, 2007 Park & Recreation Board – page 3 of 8
Mr. Carpenter stated he likes the idea of isolating the kid pools and the proposal to use
new technology to keep them clean.
Mr. Wallover stated there are also new technologies for using salt as a means of
generating chorine. He stated they may want to consider this as time goes on. He stated
there is a cost savings over time since you are not transporting chlorine and do not have
the potential problems with mixing chemicals. Mr. Newbon stated he is familiar with
this system, and it is very easy to maintain.
Mr. Wallover asked if they would like to maintain the pavilion, and it was the consensus
of the Park & Rec Board that they would like to maintain it.
Mr. Wallover stated they will need a topo survey from the bathhouse to the fence line.
He stated he will provide Ms. Liney with a breakdown of what they need to have on the
survey, and Ms. Liney stated she will then contact the Township engineer. Mr. Wallover
stated he will provide a list by the next meeting of the interactive playthings
they may want to consider for the tot pool. Mr. Newbon stated he feels they need to do
some grading work in the area of the tot pool, and Mr. Wallover stated this is why he is
asking for the topo. There were discussions about the grading in the area of the tot pool.
Mr. Wallover stated the tot pool does not seem like it is part of the complex with the
chain link fence. He stated possibly they could lower the area one or two feet. He feels
if they used a different type of fencing, it would help the staff see the activity even if it is
at a lower grade. Mr. Fritchey stated they do have to maintain a sense of separation for
the children, but noted it does not have to be as drastic. Mr. Carpenter noted the runway
up to the tot pool and feels this creates a dangerous situation noting the gates are not
always kept closed and children could run down the runway and out. Mr. Wallover
showed a location on the Plan where it could be moved slightly so that they could
maintain control. Mr. Stoloski stated it will have to be moved over slightly to expand the
snack bar seating area. He noted this is a heavy traffic area with the bathrooms in the
area as well. He stated many people coming to this tot area like to have direct, easy
access because they are coming in with strollers, bags, etc. Mr. Wallover stated possibly
they could bring it down a few inches.
There was further discussion on the potential of a child to get out of the tot pool area, and
Mr. Wallover stated all the gates they are now using have self closures. He stated it will
be closer to the main office so that the staff will have a better look at the area.
Mr. Stoloski stated he feels some of the least utilized spaces are the hill before the baby
pool, the small sliver of grass on the other side of the current entry ramp, and the grass on
the far side. He stated if they are going to try to expand the seating area, they should look
at that grass. He noted an area where there are currently three tables, but due to the
grade, they can only use half of the grass. He feels it should be landscaped for
appearance purposes or in some other way be incorporated into the snack bar.
September 11, 2007 Park & Recreation Board – page 4 of 8
Mr. Wallover stated they are finding at most facilities that people want more shade
structures. Mr. Newbon stated it is difficult to find shade out near the other pools as well.
Mr. Wallover agreed to provide photos of some shade structures they have used in other
pools. He stated they may want to consider a three to five year period where they would
be adding a few pieces each year.
Mr. Fritchey stated they must also consider the bottom line for the entire project.
Mr. Wallover stated what he has proposed would cost approximately $750,000 to
$800,000. Mr. Fritchey stated he feels this is a realistic number from the Supervisors’
standpoint. Mr. Santarsiero stated he feels these are things that need to be done.
Mr. Fritchey stated he feels they should consider what is
essential from an
standpoint and sound maintenance, and then prioritize these items. Mr. Wallover stated
the initial piece was the new tot pool and supporting facilities and the second was the
considered approximately $450,000 to expand the intermediate pool by 10’ and upgrade
it. Mr. Santarsiero stated the intermediate pool is always crowded. Mr. Liney stated there were concerns about expanding this pool in past discussions. She stated
Mr. Wallover was considering expanding the pool by 10’ taking away part of the sidewalk. Mr. Wallover noted when this pool was built it was pitched toward the pool. Mr. Stoloski stated when they built the new pool, Mr. Magg and Mr. Sharp had indicated the hope was to try to pull some of the people out of this intermediate pool, but many parents are reluctant to leave this zone and like to locate in this area. Mr. Newbon this area is one of the top areas where people are sitting; and Mr. Wallover stated this is because of the shade in the area.
Ms. Bunn joined the meeting at this time.
The Board took the opportunity to tour the Pool Complex. There was discussion during
the Tour about the possibility of a Myrtha vinyl-on-steel lining for the intermediate pool
and the possibility of expanding the pool 10’ on one side and 10’ on the opposite side.
The liner has a 15 year guarantee. The proposed location for the
shown at the end of the large pool. The need for a second exit/entrance at the shallow
end of the pool was also discussed. Mr. Newbon stated if they are taking away some of
the shaded seating area because of the expansion of the intermediate pool, they need to
consider areas where additional shaded areas could be located
The meeting was reconvened and Mr. Fritchey asked if they did the intermediate pool as
one project and the tot pool and
projects be approximately $750,000 and be large enough for contractors to bid on.
Mr. Wallover stated he does feel that they are at the bottom end; but if they do enough
advertising to get the contractors interested, he feels they can make it work. He stated
they would get better pricing if they could do it all at once, and more contractors would
September 11, 2007 Park & Recreation Board – page 5 of 8
be interested in a $1.5 million project done at one time. Mr. Newbon asked if they could
bid it as one project but do it as a two-phase project; and Mr. Wallover stated he does not
feel the contractors would hold the price. He noted the cost increases for PVC pipe and
stainless steel. Mr. Fritchey asked if they split the job 50/50, they would be at the lower
end; but if they split it any other way, they may only get the expensive job done, and not
get anyone to come in for the lesser project. Mr. Wallover stated his recent experience
has been that they could not get people to bid on a $300,000 project. Mr. Wallover stated
they could bid it all and have three alternates one being the ramp, one being the
intermediate pool, and one being the tot pool and they can then determine which ones
they want to do. Mr. Fritchey stated the Park & Recreation Board could make a
recommendation to the Supervisors this evening and then it could be put out to bid and
they can then decide what they want to move forward on. Mr. Wallover stated they
should also consider when they are going to put this out to bid. He stated he feels they
should bid this in June, 2008 for a fall, 2008 start with it coming on line in 2009. He
does not feel there is sufficient time to do all the detail work and get it bid, constructed
and ready for next year. He stated they would be able to get the work done between
September, 2008 and May, 2009.
Mr. Wallover stated if they like the vinyl system for the intermediate pool, they may also
want to consider using this in the tot pool as well as they may get a better price.
Ms. Bunn stated she would like to see how this technology works with one pool first.
Mr. Wallover suggested they look at a pool he is aware of in Quakertown where they
have used this system very effectively. Mr. McDonald stated he would like to look at
that facility. Mr. Wallover noted other facilities which are making use of this material as
well. He stated it is not slippery. He stated it would not be necessary to paint the pools
every year if this material was used. He discussed other pools where they used the
Myrtha system; and in certain applications, especially where renovation is involved, he
does not feel they should use anything else. He stated the fact that there is a fifteen year
warranty as opposed to a one year warranty speaks volumes.
Mr. Wallover agreed to come up with some concepts and present them to the Park & Rec
Board at their meeting in October. He will also provide information in the interim on the
different systems he has discussed.
Mr. Fritchey moved, Mr. Newbon seconded and it was unanimously carried to
recommend to the Board of Supervisors that they consider the following improvements to
the Pool Complex: 1) Rebuilding the baby pool with corresponding changes to the
Snack area; 2) 40% increase in the size of the intermediate pool; and 3) construction
broken out in the bid.
It was noted that once a concept is decided on, they could provide this to the Disabled
Persons Advisory Board for their review.
September 11, 2007 Park & Recreation Board – page 6 of 8
Mr. Fritchey noted the letter from Rheta Pinsky an individual who was ill this year and
unable to use her Pool members who is requesting a refund. Ms. Liney stated she did
speak to Ms. Pinsky advising that this was not Pool policy and perhaps she would like to
have this as a credit toward 2008. She indicated she would prefer to have her money.
Mr. Fritchey moved, Mr. Newbon seconded and it was unanimously carried to refund her
Mr. Wallover left the meeting at this time.
SUPERVISOR LIAISON REPORT
Mr. Santarsiero stated the Board of Supervisors will be considering Snipes at Budget
time. He stated they still have the issue with Samost as well. He stated they were asking
Mr. Majewski to look at some reconfigurations, and they are still looking into this.
Mr. Santarsiero stated they had a very successful Community Day, and he feels the
community is very interested in coming together and in recreational uses. He stated the
Board of Supervisors is cognizant that a big part of the quality of life in the Township
relates to the recreation facilities, and they want to keep them in good order and provide
sufficient facilities for the demands of the Township. He stated the Pool continues to be
a crown jewel of the Township, and the Golf Course is moving in this way as well.
Mr. Newbon stated that he heard that other communities are looking to float Bonds for
additional open space and asked if
stated the County does have an Open Space Question on the ballot which he feels will
pass so there will be money from that will be available to
they may have to consider if the Township wants to consider their own Bond Issue as
well. He stated the EAC is working on an open space inventory. He stated his concern
was that there is beginning to be infill in a number of the smaller open lots left in the
Township. Last year he proposed to the Board of Supervisors that the EAC do an
inventory of all remaining open space parcels so that they can prioritize these as to how
they may want to preserve them. He stated they should also consider if the land is really
developable under the new Ordinances; and if not, they would be at a lesser priority for
purchase by the Township. He stated he feels this report will be submitted by the EAC in
the fall. He stated these parcels will be prioritized and the costs considered to see if they
need to go out to a Referendum to see if they want to have another Bond Issue. He stated
there is $2 million left from the last Referendum. He stated half of this money may go to
the remaining issue with Samost which means there would be $1 million left. This $1
million would have to be used for land acquisition or purchase of development rights.
September 11, 2007 Park & Recreation Board – page 7 of 8
POOL MANAGER’S REPORT
Mr. Stoloski stated this summer membership was increased by approximately 50 patrons.
He spoke to a number of people on Community Pride Day when they had 5,000 people
through the gate. He stated they had no major injuries at the Pool this year. They
continue to maintain all the facilities they have so there is no need for anything major
other than general maintenance and what was discussed this evening. He stated they
came in First place for the A Team and fourth for the B Team
Lifeguard Competition this year where fourteen Teams competed. He stated they do
In-Service a number of times throughout the summer and have an excellent, well-trained
staff. He stated they had a successful Swim Lesson program, and the Swim Team had
record numbers this year. He stated there was a 3.5% increase in money taken in, and
they had a surplus this year.
Mr. Santarsiero asked about net profits. Mr. Stoloski stated total brought in was
$661,000 and the previous year it was $638,000. Mr. Santarsiero asked about the net
profits; but Ms Liney stated she had not yet completed the Budget for expenditures, although expenditures were running less than what was Budgeted. Mr. Newbon asked if the number brought in this year includes people who come in and pay a daily fee; and
Mr. Stoloski stated it does not. Ms. Liney stated that is considered sales, and it normally
brings in approximately $50,000.
RECREATION DIRECTOR’S REPORT
Ms. Liney stated the Township’s recent Community Pride Day was another huge success,
and Park & Recreation was happy to be a part of it. Attendance was estimated in the
10,000 person range; and on behalf of the Township she thanked all the volunteers and
sponsors who contributed to making this a terrific day for the community.
Ms. Liney stated the fall season is underway in the Park system with football, soccer,
baseball, and tennis all using Township facilities. This past Saturday was Picture Day
resulting in a large volume of people at Macclesfield park. The park crew has completed
painting directional arrows as well as installation of additional traffic signage at
Macclesfield to help guide new Park users through the facility.
Ms. Liney stated several events were held at the
this weekend. The
were both well attended.
Ms. Liney stated the highly successful weekly Farmers Market in support of the local
farmers in the area will continue at the
September 11, 2007 Park & Recreation Board – page 8 of 8
Ms. Liney stated the initial draft of the 2008 Park and Recreation Operating Budget is
being worked on. Commitments for debt service obligations as well as larger scale
maintenance projects such as resurfacing tennis courts and addressing the aged light
systems will be examined. There is an underlying mandate of no tax increase for 2008 in
the Park & Recreation Operating Budget. The Board of Supervisors will look at the
Budget based on the upcoming needs both long and short term. The good news is the
utilization by residents continues to increase, and we continue to receive positive
feedback from those enjoying the facilities.
Ms. Liney stated the Community Pool had another great season this year experiencing a
4% growth in membership. A key component in the success of the Pool is the Pool
management. Pool Manager Greg Stoloski and staff did an excellent job throughout the
summer, particularly with Community Pride Day. Records indicate over 200,000 people
enjoyed the Pools in 2007 with no significant safety incidents. A long-range plan of
action was adopted for the Pool in 2002. The Township continues to implement those
improvements requested by the Pool membership as well as necessary maintenance
projects to keep the Pool a top-notch facility which attracts and retains members. No tax
dollars support the Community Pool.
There being no further business, Ms. Bunn moved, Mr. McDonald seconded and it was unanimously carried to adjourn the meeting at 8:25 p.m.
Patricia Bunn, Secretary